Could Tweaking Our Memories Help Us Feel Better?
Can we replace bad memories with good memories or even erase certain memories to improve our mental health? Neuroscientist and 2015 National Geographic Emerging Explorer Steve Ramirez is pioneering ways to manipulate memories, hoping his work may one day lead to novel methods of treating PTSD, depression, and Alzheimer's.
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Transcript
What if we could use positive memories as a weapon to
suppress certain symptoms associated with mood disorders like depression, for
example bringing back a memory that was once thought to be lost in a patient
with Alzheimer's. Or going in and turning the dial down on the emotional
gut-wrenching I hate my life feeling of something like PTSD. Imagine being able
to turn the dial down on those negative emotions.
Alright, so to start off, just by a show of hands who here
would erase a memory of an ex-boyfriend or girlfriend? This is like therapy
session for me to make myself feel better, so...
So, the work that I've been doing at MIT... focuses, more
seriously, on finding individual memories in the brain and trying to actually tinker
with those memories. Can we turn them on, can we turn them off can we change
the contents of those memories? Ethical stuff aside, you can imagine the
implications for things like actually being able to activate memories in Alzheimer's,
for example. Or using memories to combat certain symptoms associated with psychiatric
disorders.
So, let's take a step back to... if we're going to go into
the brain and look for a memory where would we actually look? How do we find a
memory in the sea of the... eighty-six billion brain cells that you have?
So, this is a picture of me drowning in the Dominican
Republic. This was a few years back on spring break and I went with a couple of
friends and... Dominican Republic, spring break, awesome. Kayaking in the
ocean, terrible idea. Because it feels like you're on an aquatic treadmill the
entire time not getting anywhere. Inevitably, you capsize and also inevitably,
your very good friends sit on shore taking pictures of you dying. So, when I'm
recalling this memory of nearly drowning in the Dominican Republic what brain
areas are lighting up, right? Like, where would you actually go and see this particular
memory? If you were to ignore all human ethics for a second and slice up my
brain, you would see that one of the areas that really lights up is an area
called the hippocampus. You've probably heard of this as It's one of the more popular
brain areas. It's what Dory from Finding Nemo probably had damaged it's what...
It's what Matt Damon in the Bourne Trilogy probably had damaged, or just Matt Damon
in general. And... So, the hippocampus really lights up. So, this gives us a
hint as to where we can go into the brain and actually look for a particular
memory.
The main question that we started off tackling in grad
school is can we go in, can we find the brain cells that are active during a
particular memory and again, can we actually modulate those brain cells. So,
what we would do is, uh, we would go in we would find these brain cells that we
think are holding on to a particular memory and we would actually artificially
install a light-sensitive switch in those brain cells. So, that means that we
can actually take an optic fiber, do some careful brain surgery and actually
shoot lasers into the brain and reactivate these brain cells or inactivate these
brain cells that we think are housing a particular memory. This is my favorite
picture that I have taken in all of graduate school. If you were to slice your hippocampus
along this direction going back and back and back, this is what it would look like.
And what we have here is brain cells that are holding on to a particular fear
memory, in this case. And not only have these cells been tricked to... respond
to pulses of light but they've also been tricked to just glow green. So, what
you're looking at is actually what a cross-section of a memory looks like at the
level of the brain. Where the seemingly ephemeral stuff that you can't really go
in and poke you can actually go in and, if you have a small enough finger actually
poke and isolate those brain cells. That's what a memory looks like at the
level of the brain. So, given this technique now of actually going in and
shooting light into the brain we wanted to ask, can we just activate a memory. Can
we go in, can we flick it on?
This is just an example of one of the mice that we use and we
can actually go in and again, shoot lasers into the brain. The brain doesn't
have any pain receptors, so... no mice were harmed, I guess, in this process. The
experiment is actually reasonably straightforward. All we do is we put an animal
in a blue box. Or we'll just call it box A. And then we give it a couple of
mild foot shocks, just... it has to form a memory, right? So, it forms a fear
memory of those mild foot shocks. So, it's like static, right? It doesn't really
hurt. So, it's more of the surprise. So, they form this fear memory and we find
the brain cells that are active when the animal is actually forming this
particular memory and we trick those brain cells to respond to just the brief
pulses of light. So, the million-dollar experiment now is we put the animal in
a completely different environment where nothing bad has happened to them. And
then we shoot light into the brain and we ask is it thinking about the fear
memory of the blue box. Now, in animals, uh, we used fear just because it's super
easy to measure. You can tell when an animal is scared. So, fear manifests itself
in mice as the animal just going huddling in a corner in an immobilized posture
not wanting to move 'cause it doesn't want to be detected by a predator. We
call that freezing because the animal looks like it's frozen in place. This was
the very first animal that we ran, 2011. So, this animal it's in environment B,
it has no reason to be scared about the environment. It's running around, it's
sniffing around it's minding its own business. We turn the light on and as you
can see its behavior doesn't really dramatically change. That's a good thing. Then
the same exact animal, we give it a fear memory. We trick that fear memory to
respond to a pulse of light. And now it's in this environment again has no
reason to be scared about it. It's running around, minding its own business. And
then you shoot light into the brain and it goes into that freezing posture. So,
that was our first successful demonstration that we can actually bring back to
life a particular fear memory in the brain.
Well, if we can actually tinker with a particular memory could
we try to create a false memory? Can we change the contents of a memory? To try
to create a false memory what we would do is we would put our animals in, once
again, a blue box. And then, very simple, we just find the brain cells that are
active when the animal is forming this particular memory of the blue box. We
would trick those brain cells to respond to pulses of light. Next, we put the animals
in a red box. Very different environment different sights, sounds, smells, the
works. And then we give it a couple of mild foot shocks so that it's forming a
fear memory. But while we give them these mild foot shocks we shoot light into
the brain so that it recalls the memory of the blue box So, that's the attempt to
try to associate the memory of the blue box where nothing happened and the
aversive information coming into the animal in the form of a foot shock. So,
the test here is when we put it now in the blue box it should be scared, even
though nothing bad technically happened in that blue box. And that's exactly
what happens. These animals, when we put them back in the blue box show that
fearful behavior, even though they have no reason to technically be scared
about it. So, to what end... like, why are we going in and actually
manipulating memories why are we going in and activating fear memories and so
on.
Now, let's take a step back to the 1950s. The 1950s saw a
very real massive revolution in neuroscience and pharmacology. Every single
drug that's available today Prozac, anxiolytics, the works are iterations of
their 1950's counterparts. Every single one, it's amazing. And yet, in a decade
that revolution stalled. Every single drug today is basically the same as the
one in the 1950s. That's not okay, that's not how you improve a field. So, what
happened, I would argue, is that we stopped thinking outside the box. We
started studying drugs, and we stopped studying people. We saw them as
moneymakers and not actually going in and trying to treat these diseases that
have been around with us for as long as we've had the ability to feel. So, for
my last project in graduate school, I thought somewhat not modestly, can we just
restart this revolution. Can we actually think outside the box and just use
novel approaches to try to intervene with some of these psychiatric disorders. So...
we thought, given this memory manipulation technology could we actually go in
and activate let's say, something like a positive memory. What if we could use
positive memories as a weapon to suppress certain symptoms associated with mood
disorders like depression, for example. So, in humans it's really intuitive,
right? Positive memories feel good. Memory of the Red Sox winning the World
Series for me feels fantastic. And, if you're from New York, I'm sorry I'm not
sorry. So... And... memories of Cape Cod also feel amazing for me. These things
they are actually naturally rewarding. They light up a lot of the circuitry that
lights up when you have Pepsi or when you actually undergo some other rewarding
experiences.
This begs the question, well, we're working with mice, so what
does a positive memory actually look like in a mouse? Um, it's pretty
straightforward. When you expose a male mouse to a female mouse they go bananas
over it, so we put male mice in box with female mice and if you've been to a
bar at like one-thirty in the morning you know exactly what this behavior looks
like. Also conserved across the evolutionary ladder. So what we can do is we
can find the brain cells that are active when the animal is forming this particular
positive experience. Once again, trick those brain cells to respond to pulses
of light. So, we wanted to ask can we actually go and intervene in some of
these disorders and to what extent can we actually model these in animals. So...
one task that we use to measure in this case, the inability to experience or
seek out pleasure also known as anhedonia, right. We give these animals a
choice between sugar water and regular water. Now, animals that don't show
symptoms associated with depression, for example choose sugar water about 80
percent of the time. It tastes better, it's like Coca-Cola or Pepsi like, it's
just something that they find more rewarding. Animals that show symptoms associated
with depression, on the other hand show a 50-50 preference for sugar water and
regular water. That's what we consider the inability to actually go out and find
or experience pleasure in the world. But what if we can activate a positive
memory? What happens to that symptom of anhedonia of not being able to experience
pleasure? What happens is the animals immediately prefer sugar water about 80
percent of the time. So, we were successfully able to suppress that symptom
associated with depression simply by harnessing the brain's internal powers and
just jump-starting a positive memory. What if you actually go and reactivate these
positive memories over and over and over again, right? We all know our
personalities exist along a spectrum. Some people are slightly more optimistic some
people are a little bit more ee-ee-ee... And, this just it exists there's a spectrum
of differences in, this kind of, mood. So... all we did was we went into the
brain we reactivated this positive memory over and over and over again, for
about a week. And actually, not only did it actually suppress a medley of
symptoms associated with depression it actually increased the number of new born
brain cells. The brain actually grew as a result. It's almost as if we were harnessing
the brain's natural powers and we forced it to fix itself. And it fixed itself
by making new brain cells.
This begs the inevitable question should we actually... should
we do this in humans? I mean, the technology doesn't exist yet but it's
important that we start this conversation yesterday so that we can actually
have the proper social and legal infrastructure for these kind of things that actually
might be possible. Again, you don't have to imagine any more the possibility of
bringing back a memory that was once thought to be lost, in a patient with
Alzheimer's. Or imagine going in and turning the dial down on the emotional
gut-wrenching I hate my life feeling of... not a breakup but something more seriously,
something like PTSD. Imagine being able to turn the dial down on those negative
emotions. Or being able to jump start particular moods when your mood is really
low or even under depression, uh, in a depressed state. So, those are the
things that we don't have to imagine any more. Those are the things that we are
on the cusp of actually being able to do with, I think, powerful therapeutic
value. Now... we know so much from this animal research because in this case,
you know, there's a lot of brain areas that are actually conserved across the
evolutionary ladder. And, uh... both processes, memory and psychiatric
disorders they are just this physical as, say a broken leg. Like, we know that
in humans a broken leg will give you broken locomotion. And we know that,
through neuroscience we know that broken brains give rise to broken thoughts. Both
still require physical intervention. And in order to come up with new
interventions we have to continue to actually explore... exploration, that's the
right word. Because that means actually reaching that edge of what is known and
unknown and truly pushing forward. And thereby, we make the unknown known. Thank
you.